{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":null,"startTime":0.84,"endTime":2.79,"body":"Kevin: Welcome to Innovate and React."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3.18,"endTime":9.144,"body":"Today's episode will be about howwe can turn waste into fuel to the"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":9.214,"endTime":11.934,"body":"defossilize, mobility and transportation."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":12.444,"endTime":18.297,"body":"I'm very happy to have Theresa K\u00f6ffleras my guest to today because, uh, she's"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":18.297,"endTime":23.217,"body":"working on a demonstration plant forthis technology at BEST in Vienna."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":23.697,"endTime":26.727,"body":"So you are the first guest."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":27.027,"endTime":29.267,"body":"Which is not based in Germany actually."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":29.767,"endTime":30.707,"body":"Welcome Theresa."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":31.502,"endTime":34.922,"body":"Theresa: Thank you very much, uh,for having me here in your podcast."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":34.922,"endTime":40.432,"body":"I'm very honored, to be here and I wasreally flattered when I got your message"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":40.432,"endTime":43.882,"body":"and request, um, for this podcast episode."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":43.882,"endTime":45.752,"body":"So yes, I am, from Austria."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":46.142,"endTime":49.502,"body":"I'm also originally from Austria,from the southern part of Austria,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":49.892,"endTime":54.872,"body":"and I'm currently working at theSyngas platform, Vienna at best."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":54.932,"endTime":62.002,"body":"Um, as you already have, explained, um,it's a research company with the full name"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":62.052,"endTime":64.122,"body":", bioenergy and sustainable technologies."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":64.912,"endTime":65.002,"body":"Kevin: Mm-hmm."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":65.697,"endTime":71.569,"body":"And as I understood, you were,um, coming from the university,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":71.569,"endTime":76.729,"body":"basically, or the, the companyis founded from the university."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":77.479,"endTime":79.564,"body":"How did this, uh, company start?"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":80.247,"endTime":80.607,"body":". Theresa: Yeah."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":80.607,"endTime":85.527,"body":"So, uh, the company best in longbioenergy and sustainable technologies"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":85.887,"endTime":88.977,"body":"began its journey in 2003."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":89.457,"endTime":96.147,"body":"Um, under the name Austrian BioenergyCenter, ABC as Austria's First Competence"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":96.147,"endTime":98.627,"body":"Center for Thermal biomass utilization."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":99.667,"endTime":105.337,"body":"In 2008, it was renamed tobioenergy, uh, 2020 plus."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":105.847,"endTime":111.217,"body":"So we have had quite a few, uh, namechanges, uh, within our journey."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":111.517,"endTime":118.027,"body":"And finally, in 2019, the company adoptedits current name BEST, and we are now"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":118.027,"endTime":123.517,"body":"aiming on, um, being the link betweenresearch and industrial application."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":124.032,"endTime":128.172,"body":"To strengthen Austria Scientificand Technological Foundation"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":128.172,"endTime":129.492,"body":"in biomass conversion."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":129.58,"endTime":129.85,"body":"Kevin: Mm-hmm."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":130.645,"endTime":136.405,"body":"Theresa: Um, and best does thatvia like applied R and D focus"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":136.405,"endTime":142.515,"body":"on bio-refinery processes, um, todevelop and demonstrate thermochemical"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":142.515,"endTime":144.795,"body":"syngas conversion technologies."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":145.185,"endTime":151.875,"body":"So that is basically our researchfocus on the conversion of biomass."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":152.685,"endTime":154.035,"body":"Um, in our company."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":154.035,"endTime":159.595,"body":"There are also several other, areas thatare doing research in other fields like"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":159.625,"endTime":165.565,"body":"automation and control, or we also haveanother research group that is looking"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":165.565,"endTime":171.145,"body":"into, um, the sustainability of theseprocesses and looking on the value chains."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":171.655,"endTime":178.755,"body":"But, my research group is located inVienna, so the capital of Austria, um, and"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":178.875,"endTime":184.005,"body":"the headquarter of our company is situatedin Graz, which is the second largest city."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":184.65,"endTime":189.9,"body":"Um, and, we have around 100 employeesat the moment, so we are not like"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":189.9,"endTime":191.61,"body":"that big, but also not that small."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":191.685,"endTime":195.255,"body":"Kevin: Yeah, but for research,uh, company, I think that's."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":195.885,"endTime":201.231,"body":"Not tiny like I know some,uh, from the university  and"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":201.231,"endTime":202.971,"body":"they're just handful of people."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":203.031,"endTime":208.691,"body":"So a hundred people is already quitebig and, uh, you're trying to close"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":208.721,"endTime":214.661,"body":"the gap between the research fromuniversities and fundamental research to"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":214.661,"endTime":218.441,"body":"the giant industrial processes, right."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":219.386,"endTime":220.286,"body":"Theresa: Yes, exactly."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":220.341,"endTime":224.766,"body":"So we see ourselves as,um, the bridge between, the"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":224.826,"endTime":226.866,"body":"universities and the industry."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":227.016,"endTime":231.426,"body":"So we have like several projectswhere we have different stakeholders"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":231.426,"endTime":233.256,"body":"and, uh, partners involved."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":233.256,"endTime":236.736,"body":"Like we have a lot of, differentuniversities like the technical University"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":236.736,"endTime":242.316,"body":"of Vienna, but also the BOKU,  that is adifferent university also based in Vienna"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":242.316,"endTime":248.956,"body":"that is focusing more on, um, I wouldsay the woody biomass research like we"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":248.956,"endTime":254.366,"body":"say, it's a, it's the green, universityhere in Vienna, but we also have some"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":254.366,"endTime":258.956,"body":"co cooperations with the university inGraz and also international universities."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":259.316,"endTime":262.476,"body":"And we have a lot of industrypartners that come to us, um, if"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":262.476,"endTime":267.106,"body":"they have any like, topics that youwant to look into in more depth."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":267.436,"endTime":272.186,"body":"And we bring all of the stakeholderstogether and try to create a project"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":272.756,"endTime":279.026,"body":"that is then also funded by the partners,but also by the national agency, uh,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":279.026,"endTime":281.596,"body":"which is called FFG, in Austria here."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":281.746,"endTime":285.736,"body":"But we are also participating inseveral European projects where"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":285.736,"endTime":291.256,"body":"we do d different topics andprojects, uh, throughout Europe."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":291.286,"endTime":291.766,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":292.556,"endTime":292.636,"body":"Kevin: Yeah."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":292.636,"endTime":297.616,"body":"I think that's a very important workbecause especially in these newer kind"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":297.616,"endTime":303.871,"body":"of technologies, it's also for bigcompanies to start their own research"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":303.871,"endTime":308.491,"body":"on this is a bit hesitant sometimesbecause it's a lot of commitment."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":308.521,"endTime":313.471,"body":"And when they can cooperate withcompanies like you and have also"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":314.221,"endTime":318.391,"body":"parts of the university and governmentfunding into this, it's a lot"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":318.391,"endTime":321.361,"body":"less, uh, commitment, I would say."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":321.361,"endTime":327.511,"body":"But still it brings the technologyforward, which is then yeah, the"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":327.561,"endTime":329.541,"body":"basis for the future technology."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":329.837,"endTime":330.613,"body":"Theresa: Yes, exactly."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":330.613,"endTime":336.143,"body":"So like we aim on encouraging theindustry partners to adopt our"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":336.143,"endTime":340.403,"body":"technologies and to build, um, thesetechnologies in the larger scale."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":340.773,"endTime":345.723,"body":"Because we only have pilot anddemonstration plans, but, uh, for the"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":345.723,"endTime":351.853,"body":"processes to be economically viable, um,you have to upscale it a little bit more."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":352.453,"endTime":357.433,"body":"And for sure, like these new technologies,they always have some risk involved."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":357.433,"endTime":362.123,"body":"And, um, the industry partners,they first want to see that"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":362.123,"endTime":366.263,"body":"these processes work before theyinvest in these new technologies."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":366.263,"endTime":369.793,"body":"And so they are, um, really,willing to cooperate a lot."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":369.793,"endTime":374.203,"body":"And we have some really fruitfulconversations and projects with them."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":374.353,"endTime":374.863,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":375.008,"endTime":375.628,"body":"Kevin: Yeah, great."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":376.228,"endTime":380.938,"body":"About the pilots plant andthe, um, demonstration plans."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":380.938,"endTime":385.108,"body":"We'll be talking later, more indepth, but, uh, first, how did you"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":385.168,"endTime":389.818,"body":"get into this company you studied,uh, also in Vienna and then."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":390.654,"endTime":390.984,"body":"Theresa: Yes."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":390.994,"endTime":395.314,"body":"My academic path, um, I would saywas not really a straight line."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":395.644,"endTime":399.024,"body":"But, but still it helpedshape, where I am today."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":399.024,"endTime":404.544,"body":"So I started out, um, at a highschool with the focus on languages."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":405.064,"endTime":410.634,"body":"But there I had a really inspiringand unconventional physics teacher"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":411.054,"endTime":417.254,"body":"that inspired me to go into, therenewable sector, I would say, because"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":417.254,"endTime":420.344,"body":"he was talking a lot about the climatechange and I, and I said, yeah, okay."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":421.424,"endTime":425.134,"body":"That is a huge thing and I alsowant to like, create an impact and"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":425.254,"endTime":427.974,"body":"try to help solve this big issue."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":428.544,"endTime":434.884,"body":"And then, um, I started to search forbachelor's degree in that area and"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":434.884,"endTime":441.074,"body":"then I found one which was called, um,environmental Systems Studies in Graz."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":441.644,"endTime":446.414,"body":"And then I did my bachelor or I,I started there and then after two"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":446.414,"endTime":451.404,"body":"semesters when I like got an, got anoverview, about the course program,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":451.404,"endTime":453.324,"body":"I said, yeah, okay, that's nice."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":453.324,"endTime":458.574,"body":"And we get an insight into, intothe various areas like chemistry,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":458.574,"endTime":460.854,"body":"physics, also mathematics and so on."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":460.854,"endTime":463.314,"body":"But I didn't really knowwhat to do with that."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":463.314,"endTime":470.214,"body":"And also I was, lacking the aspect oftechnology in this, um, study program."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":470.514,"endTime":474.654,"body":"So I then again had another lookand looked at other universities"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":474.654,"endTime":478.914,"body":"and found that the technicaluniversity of Graz, the, um,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":478.914,"endTime":481.354,"body":"bachelor program process engineering."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":481.834,"endTime":487.204,"body":"I found that and I like lookedinto the curriculum and it was"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":487.414,"endTime":489.154,"body":"exactly what I was looking for."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":489.154,"endTime":494.644,"body":"Like, it was a combination of processengineering and also chemistry with"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":494.674,"endTime":500.134,"body":"which I thought it, and this would bea good combination to go then into the"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":500.134,"endTime":502.654,"body":"en environmental engineering direction."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":503.404,"endTime":507.514,"body":"And so I, uh, finished both bachelordegrees because the other one was also"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":507.514,"endTime":509.434,"body":"interesting, but I didn't really see."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":509.869,"endTime":511.489,"body":"My, my path there."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":511.879,"endTime":515.519,"body":"So then, um, I completedmy bachelor's in Graz"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":516.094,"endTime":517.954,"body":"Kevin: So you have both Bachelor's in?"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":517.954,"endTime":518.824,"body":"In both fields."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":519.919,"endTime":520.819,"body":"Theresa: yes, exactly."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":521.389,"endTime":521.689,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":521.749,"endTime":521.899,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":522.859,"endTime":526.069,"body":"I, I would not recommenddoing two bachelor degrees"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":526.069,"endTime":527.929,"body":"in parallel, but it's nice."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":527.929,"endTime":533.689,"body":"And I also got some valuable insightsbecause, um, the environmental system"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":533.689,"endTime":540.589,"body":"studies was really a program wherethere are, there were a lot of different"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":540.589,"endTime":545.439,"body":"disciplines and I got to engage withdifferent students from different areas."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":545.439,"endTime":547.149,"body":"So I wouldn't miss that."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":548.079,"endTime":553.829,"body":"Um, but I wanted to go more intothe technological pathway, so I"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":553.829,"endTime":556.349,"body":"decided to also study the other one"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":557.069,"endTime":560.639,"body":"Kevin: not completelydifferent from another, right?"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":560.699,"endTime":564.689,"body":"So it's like knowledge from one ofthese degrees feeds into the other,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":564.689,"endTime":568.019,"body":"so it's not completely useless andyou don't have to start from zero."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":568.949,"endTime":569.489,"body":"Theresa: Yes, yes."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":569.519,"endTime":569.849,"body":"No."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":569.909,"endTime":575.579,"body":"Um, it is similar, but still studyingat the technical university is quite"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":575.579,"endTime":580.679,"body":"different to the, like a non-technicaluniversity where I studied before."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":581.531,"endTime":582.491,"body":"Kevin: How, is it different?"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":582.736,"endTime":584.326,"body":"Theresa: How, yeah."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":584.326,"endTime":589.896,"body":"In my opinion like in Austria at leastespecially the first few semesters you"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":589.896,"endTime":596.776,"body":"have a lot of fundamental,  basics thatyou have to learn, like thermodynamics,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":597.076,"endTime":606.591,"body":"the, the principle of chemistry, then youhave mathematics and the mechanics, uh,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":606.591,"endTime":611.644,"body":"you also have, in the first few semestersyou have to learn like a lot of these, um,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":611.644,"endTime":614.184,"body":"issues and also the engineering, basics."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":614.364,"endTime":621.054,"body":"And, um, at the University of Grazthere, we only had like physics,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":621.144,"endTime":625.524,"body":"chemistry, and mathematics, but wedidn't have like any engineering part."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":625.944,"endTime":631.434,"body":"And in my, or like, at least for me, theengineering part was quite challenging"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":631.434,"endTime":635.904,"body":"since I was studying before at a highschool with the focus on languages"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":635.904,"endTime":639.924,"body":"and I didn't have a clue about any ofthe engineering stuff and also how to"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":639.924,"endTime":642.714,"body":"draw some, some technical drawings."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":642.714,"endTime":644.364,"body":"I didn't have a clue."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":644.364,"endTime":650.964,"body":"And, um, in my opinion also,um, the, it is also like."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":651.564,"endTime":657.024,"body":"The, the professors at the technicaluniversity of Graz, they, they demand"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":657.024,"endTime":661.104,"body":"quite a lot already in the firstfew semesters, so you really have"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":661.104,"endTime":665.154,"body":"to put the effort into, if you wantto go on with it and succeed in it."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":666.144,"endTime":666.384,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":666.834,"endTime":666.984,"body":"Kevin: Yeah."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":666.984,"endTime":673.734,"body":"I think that's also why most of theengineering courses are not really easy."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":673.854,"endTime":678.204,"body":"Like you have to dig into all thesenew topics that you don't really"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":678.204,"endTime":683.394,"body":"learn in school that much, and thenat some point everything clicks"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":683.394,"endTime":684.519,"body":"together, but that takes a while."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":685.749,"endTime":686.769,"body":"Theresa: Yeah, exactly."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":687.049,"endTime":690.979,"body":"For example, like thermodynamics,um, I really like that course and"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":691.009,"endTime":693.889,"body":"I have a lot of other colleaguesthat were really struggling a lot."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":693.889,"endTime":698.989,"body":"But for me, like, um, you, you haveto come to the point where you, we"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":699.139,"endTime":703.309,"body":"clicks and you then really understandit and you then you, you can then"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":703.309,"endTime":707.059,"body":"solve the problems easily because youunderstand the underlying principles."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":707.059,"endTime":710.839,"body":"But, um, to come to thatpoint, that takes some while."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":711.328,"endTime":714.928,"body":"So once you get a solid graspof the fundamentals, um, the"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":714.928,"endTime":716.668,"body":"fun part actually starts."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":716.908,"endTime":719.998,"body":"So you get to chooseyour, uh, specialization."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":720.368,"endTime":725.468,"body":"Within the master's program, I specializedin plant and process engineering with"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":725.468,"endTime":728.248,"body":"a focus on environment and resources."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":728.938,"endTime":732.388,"body":"My journey, then kicked off witha semester abroad in Bologna."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":732.903,"endTime":737.643,"body":"In Italy, uh, it was right in themiddle of COVID, which brought"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":737.643,"endTime":738.933,"body":"its own set of challenges."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":739.623,"endTime":740.703,"body":"But despite that,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":741.19,"endTime":742.465,"body":"Kevin: Yeah, that's a shame."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":742.803,"endTime":747.303,"body":"Theresa: but since, um, I went thereafter the first wave in Italy, it"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":747.303,"endTime":751.653,"body":"was quite, quite enjoyable and wewere able to do also stuff that we"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":751.653,"endTime":753.513,"body":"couldn't do in Austria at that time."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":753.753,"endTime":759.763,"body":"So I had also an, an amazing time studyingand living in such a lively student city."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":760.553,"endTime":766.29,"body":"Um, after that I returned to completemy masters at the TV where I took a"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":766.29,"endTime":769.11,"body":"course, which was taught by Mathias Kuba."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":769.91,"endTime":773.39,"body":"Who, as it turns out now,uh, is my current boss."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":774.02,"endTime":779.623,"body":"Uh, that's also  when I first  heard aboutBest, um, because he presented it to us"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":779.623,"endTime":785.953,"body":"and we were able to, uh, go on a sitevisit and I was immediately fascinated by"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":785.953,"endTime":787.963,"body":"the applied research you were doing there."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":788.413,"endTime":791.833,"body":"So soon after I started mymaster thesis with them."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":792.533,"endTime":800.573,"body":"Um, and well, they haven't gotten ridof me yet, so,  um, I'm now in my PhD,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":800.693,"endTime":807.563,"body":"uh, doing my PhD there, focusing onsynthesis, um, in a very young, passionate"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":807.623,"endTime":809.663,"body":"and highly motivated research group."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":810.107,"endTime":811.156,"body":"Kevin: Yeah, that sounds great."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":811.273,"endTime":817.142,"body":"Talking off the topics,you're, now studying, the"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":817.172,"endTime":821.372,"body":"conversion of waste into fuels."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":821.942,"endTime":828.292,"body":"And, um, in the last episode of thepodcast, we were also talking about, uh,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":828.352,"endTime":835.822,"body":"energy carriers from CO2 and hydrogen,how we can basically synthesize fuels."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":836.497,"endTime":840.967,"body":"Via the methanol routefrom CO2 and hydrogen."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":842.047,"endTime":846.457,"body":"And from there you canalso, um, produce jet fuels."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":847.027,"endTime":851.977,"body":"But in your case it's theFischer-Tropsch synthesis."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":852.177,"endTime":855.417,"body":"This is a relatively old technology."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":855.717,"endTime":862.497,"body":"We actually met at the um, hundredyear anniversary, uh, conference"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":862.497,"endTime":866.977,"body":"on Fisher-Tropsch Synthesis inM\u00fclheim where it was, discovered."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":867.517,"endTime":873.367,"body":"So it's a old technology, but nowhas a lot of new application, um,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":873.727,"endTime":879.247,"body":"possibilities due to the, greenchemistry research or green, uh,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":879.247,"endTime":885.567,"body":"energy research and, yeah let's firstintroduce the Fisher-Tropsch synthesis."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":885.567,"endTime":887.217,"body":"What is this reaction?"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":888.209,"endTime":888.735,"body":"Theresa: Okay."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":888.795,"endTime":889.215,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":889.215,"endTime":894.435,"body":"So, um, the Fisher Trap synthesisis basically a chemical process that"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":894.465,"endTime":900.022,"body":"converts, uh, carbon monoxide andhydrogen into liquid hydrocarbons"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":900.082,"endTime":901.582,"body":"of different chain lengths."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":901.942,"endTime":907.472,"body":"So, uh, this process, basically alwaystakes place at elevated pressure."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":907.472,"endTime":912.932,"body":"So between 20 to 30 barsand, uh, temperatures between"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":912.932,"endTime":917.522,"body":"200 and 350 degrees Celsius."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":918.102,"endTime":922.412,"body":"In my case, we are using a slurrybubble column reactor, but you can"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":922.412,"endTime":926.792,"body":"also use like different, um, reactorconfigurations, like fixed bed"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":926.812,"endTime":929.452,"body":"reactors, fluidized bed reactors."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":929.932,"endTime":933.302,"body":"There are various different,configurations that can be"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":933.302,"endTime":935.582,"body":"used with this synthesis."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":936.482,"endTime":940.142,"body":"Um, and the basis yes, is quite old."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":940.142,"endTime":943.827,"body":"So, uh, in, in the 1920s it was invented."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":944.047,"endTime":950.99,"body":"Even though it is quite old, it hasnow, uh, revival, because we now need"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":951.09,"endTime":956.4,"body":"sustainable aviation fuel and alsosustainable, um, liquid fuel in general."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":957.15,"endTime":962.83,"body":"And, the advantage, um, of it isthat if you change the feedstock, um,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":962.86,"endTime":971.405,"body":"because like earlier it was coal basedor gas based, to some bio biomass or,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":971.76,"endTime":976.23,"body":"or the waste streams, then you, thenyou create like sustainable fuel."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":977.29,"endTime":982.17,"body":"Kevin: So when the carbon sourceis different, but the process"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":982.17,"endTime":984,"body":"fundamentally stays the same."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":984,"endTime":990.907,"body":"When you have a waste stream thatis ideally organic waste, then you"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":990.907,"endTime":996.547,"body":"can also get, uh, biofuels out of itbecause the carbon eventually comes"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":996.547,"endTime":999.457,"body":"from these organic compounds, right?"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1000.402,"endTime":1001.242,"body":"Theresa: Yes, exactly."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1001.242,"endTime":1007.042,"body":"So, uh, in principle you could just,swap the fossil based, feedstocks"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1007.042,"endTime":1013.189,"body":"to non fossil based feedstocks andsubstitute that in order to create some"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1013.189,"endTime":1019.169,"body":"sustainable, um, products out of it inprinciple that that is possible to do."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1019.229,"endTime":1025.514,"body":"And we have all also demonstrated it,but big challenge is that, the fossil"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1025.514,"endTime":1027.464,"body":"based, uh, Fisher-Tropsch refineries."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1027.824,"endTime":1029.324,"body":"They are huge."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1029.74,"endTime":1033.063,"body":"They have scales of like, Ithink a production capacity"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1033.063,"endTime":1035.673,"body":"of 140,000 barrels per day."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1036.393,"endTime":1042.823,"body":"And because the feedstock deposits or thefeedstock storage they are like massive."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1042.973,"endTime":1047.953,"body":"Um, and they're concentrated insome areas like South Africa and"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1047.953,"endTime":1050.263,"body":"also other parts of, of the world."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1050.353,"endTime":1054.153,"body":"Kevin: I think China is also verybig in Fisher-Tropsch synthesis,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1054.343,"endTime":1056.683,"body":"Theresa: Yeah, Yeah,they're also quite big."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1057.033,"endTime":1061.733,"body":"I think there are some big players alsoin China that I think they are, they're"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1061.733,"endTime":1070.903,"body":"using now also, um, coal, but like theyare switching to the gas, um, as well."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1071.878,"endTime":1079.128,"body":"Um, but yeah, the problem is withswapping the fossil based feedstocks,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1079.318,"endTime":1083.608,"body":"with non-fossil based feedstock,is that we don't have these huge"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1083.878,"endTime":1089.268,"body":"amounts of, non-fossil feedstock thatwe could put into these refineries."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1090.503,"endTime":1095.268,"body":"So basically we have to scale it downthe, the technology and the reactor."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1096.018,"endTime":1101.598,"body":"And there are not a lot ofcompanies existing that want"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1101.598,"endTime":1103.578,"body":"to scale down because, uh,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1104.118,"endTime":1105.568,"body":"Kevin: usually it's always up."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1106.428,"endTime":1107.358,"body":"Theresa: yeah, exactly."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1107.358,"endTime":1111.828,"body":"And for example, Sasol, um, is ahuge player and they have like,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1112.183,"endTime":1116.593,"body":"revolutionized the market with theirtechnology and they're operating"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1116.593,"endTime":1118.393,"body":"quite well and they are huge player."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1118.753,"endTime":1122.443,"body":"And we, uh, were talking to them also."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1122.503,"endTime":1126.103,"body":"And also at the conference I wastalking to some, some colleagues."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1127.003,"endTime":1130.483,"body":"And they said, yeah, they're justnot really interested in scaling"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1130.483,"endTime":1134.113,"body":"down to our, to our size because theyhave the knowledge now for the, for"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1134.113,"endTime":1136.453,"body":"this huge, production capacities."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1136.483,"endTime":1139.783,"body":"And for them, the revenuedoesn't lie there."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1140.143,"endTime":1147.853,"body":"So, here we come into play and wewant to develop like these smaller"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1147.853,"endTime":1153.413,"body":"scale, uh, facilities that we canfeed with biogenic feedstock or"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1153.413,"endTime":1159.533,"body":"also waste material, to create thesesustainable fuel and also chemicals."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1159.938,"endTime":1163.843,"body":"Kevin: So the problem there is thatwe just don't have enough of this"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1164.933,"endTime":1165.353,"body":"Theresa: Mm-hmm."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1166.703,"endTime":1167.633,"body":"Yes, exactly."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1167.993,"endTime":1172.133,"body":"Um, or I mean, like if youwould sum it up worldwide, then"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1172.133,"endTime":1173.603,"body":"we, then we would have enough."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1173.603,"endTime":1178.343,"body":"But they are more evenly distributedthan the fossil based opponents"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1178.343,"endTime":1182.183,"body":"Kevin: so it's more a decentralizedapproach instead of the centralized"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1182.183,"endTime":1186.113,"body":"approach we have with thebig oil and coal refineries."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1187.073,"endTime":1187.763,"body":"Theresa: Exactly."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1188.003,"endTime":1194.823,"body":"So, um, I think like realistic forthese, decentralized plants would be"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1194.823,"endTime":1201.183,"body":"a size of 2000 barrels per day, whichis significantly smaller than the"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1201.183,"endTime":1206.853,"body":"huge production capacities of the nowin, in industrially operating plants."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1207.543,"endTime":1211.443,"body":"But if, if we make it smaller,then there are some advantages"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1211.443,"endTime":1216.233,"body":"that we could get out of it since,we can distribute it like widely."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1216.233,"endTime":1220.883,"body":"So, so not only in in one country,it would be possible to operate"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1220.883,"endTime":1222.113,"body":"it, but in several countries."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1222.153,"endTime":1228.373,"body":"So it would enable a country to, um,produce their fuels on their own and"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1228.373,"endTime":1230.203,"body":"they would not rely on other countries."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1231.043,"endTime":1231.883,"body":"Um,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1231.883,"endTime":1233.143,"body":"Kevin: more independent."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1234.223,"endTime":1235.123,"body":"Theresa: Yeah, exactly."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1235.363,"endTime":1240.823,"body":"Um, which is the thing I think, um, everycountry is now like really looking into,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1240.823,"endTime":1247.048,"body":"I. Because relying on others in the worldlike this is maybe not the best idea."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1247.468,"endTime":1248.968,"body":"Kevin: have seen what happened with Russia"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1250.018,"endTime":1250.678,"body":"Theresa: yes, exactly."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1250.858,"endTime":1254.188,"body":"Kevin: we were basically, thatwas in, in Germany especially, I"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1254.188,"endTime":1259.903,"body":"dunno how it's in in Austria, butin Germany all this huge chemical"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1259.903,"endTime":1265.993,"body":"sites we have, were kind of relianton the cheap Russian energy we got."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1266.623,"endTime":1273.853,"body":"And, uh, for example, in Ludwigshafen,the BASF uh, site is giant and they"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1273.853,"endTime":1279.313,"body":"have their own pipeline basically fromRussia to there, to obtain all their"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1279.373,"endTime":1282.883,"body":"carbon sources and the energy and."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1283.573,"endTime":1288.193,"body":"Now they have to think aboutnew technologies and they're"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1288.193,"endTime":1290.743,"body":"investing a lot in Yeah."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1290.743,"endTime":1296.413,"body":"Also hydrogen and I think alsobiogenic, uh, starting material to"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1296.743,"endTime":1299.713,"body":"be less dependent on these players."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1300.253,"endTime":1305.893,"body":"And this is exactly also wherethis, uh, Fischer-Tropsch feeds in."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1306.043,"endTime":1311.503,"body":"When you have a collection point for,uh, waste and they collect all the green,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1312.223,"endTime":1318.043,"body":"uh, cuttings from trees and whatever,then they could use that to produce fuel."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1319.033,"endTime":1319.843,"body":"Theresa: Yes, exactly."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1319.843,"endTime":1321.193,"body":"That would be the idea."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1321.493,"endTime":1325.863,"body":"And um, it was also Austria the casethat when we saw the crisis with"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1325.863,"endTime":1329.253,"body":"Russia, um, that we had a lot of issues."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1329.303,"endTime":1333.383,"body":"But that is, that was also a startingpoint for new technologies and"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1333.383,"endTime":1338.653,"body":"also new, uh, initiatives, from theindustry because they really wanted"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1338.653,"endTime":1341.023,"body":"to like change and they had to change."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1341.023,"endTime":1342.283,"body":"So that, that was great."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1342.283,"endTime":1346.063,"body":"I think in that perspective thatnow we, we talk more about that."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1346.583,"endTime":1352.763,"body":"But these technologies is now newso like using sustainable feedstocks"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1352.763,"endTime":1357.833,"body":"for the Fischer-Tropsch synthesis, Ithink like we are trying to do that"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1358.013,"endTime":1361.613,"body":"only like since 10 to 20 years now."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1361.613,"endTime":1369.123,"body":"And, um, this has some huge challenges,connected with the syngas production."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1369.873,"endTime":1374.583,"body":"So maybe I, I could explainfirst what Syngas is."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1374.643,"endTime":1375.243,"body":"So,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1375.273,"endTime":1375.933,"body":"Kevin: would be great."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1377.223,"endTime":1380.133,"body":"Theresa: because I think ouraudience maybe not, may, may not"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1380.133,"endTime":1384.238,"body":"know this term, but for us itis a term that we use every day."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1384.868,"endTime":1391.318,"body":"So synthesis gas is mainly a mixtureof, uh CO and hydrogen with like,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1391.358,"endTime":1398.088,"body":"it can also contain some CO2 andmethane, but the majority of it"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1398.088,"endTime":1400.428,"body":"is hydrogen and carbon monoxide."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1401.208,"endTime":1406.331,"body":"And we call it syngas because,it is utilized to synthesize"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1406.331,"endTime":1411.251,"body":"other chemicals and fuels andtherefore the abbreviation syngas."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1411.716,"endTime":1411.926,"body":"Kevin: Yeah."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1412.766,"endTime":1418.136,"body":"So the basis for a lot ofother chemical process were"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1418.136,"endTime":1418.946,"body":"processes"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1419.606,"endTime":1419.876,"body":"and."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1420.596,"endTime":1425.756,"body":"How do you get the syngasout of the biomass?"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1426.659,"endTime":1429.509,"body":"Theresa: Uh, viathermochemical conversion."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1429.779,"endTime":1437.129,"body":"So for example, in our case, at ourresearch, plant in Vienna, we use, um,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1437.339,"endTime":1439.739,"body":"our dual fluidized bed gasification."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1440.099,"endTime":1444.752,"body":"So it's basically a thermochemicalprocess where we just put in  for example,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1444.752,"endTime":1448.262,"body":"woody biomass or some sewage sludge."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1448.292,"endTime":1454.592,"body":"Or we also have tried to use, um,coconut shells or also cashew shells."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1454.682,"endTime":1458.971,"body":"So like whatever our partners giveus,  we feed it to our gasifier."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1459.391,"endTime":1465.841,"body":"And there we have temperatures between 900to 1000 and like 1,200 degrees Celsius."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1466.846,"endTime":1471.786,"body":"And, in that atmosphere with, with theaddition of steam, we then generate"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1471.786,"endTime":1478.006,"body":"this synthesis gas that we then have toclean in order to use it for the Fische-"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1478.006,"endTime":1485.496,"body":"Tropsch synthesis, and especially thiscleaning step is really crucial for, um,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1485.556,"endTime":1492.036,"body":"the utilization of this gas then for thenext synthesis steps, because the catalyst"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1492.036,"endTime":1493.986,"body":"used in Fische-\u200aTropsch synthesis."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1494.336,"endTime":1495.626,"body":"Kevin: What catalysts are these?"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1496.526,"endTime":1499.766,"body":"Theresa: yeah, we mainly useCobalt based catalysts on,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1499.826,"endTime":1502.946,"body":"um, aluminum oxide, um, basis."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1503.616,"endTime":1508.326,"body":"But there are also, uh, in theindustry iron based catalyst used."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1508.476,"endTime":1511.416,"body":"This depends on the productthat you want to obtain."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1511.416,"endTime":1516.876,"body":"If you want to obtain like morewaxes and more diesel range,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1516.926,"endTime":1521.026,"body":"products, and you, you, you most ofthe time use Cobalt based catalyst."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1522.021,"endTime":1525.291,"body":"Kevin: With the cobalt, you getlonger chain length than iron."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1525.591,"endTime":1525.621,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1526.161,"endTime":1527.001,"body":"Theresa: Yes, exactly."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1527.931,"endTime":1532.771,"body":"And, for example, also, iron basedcatalysts are mainly used for the"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1532.771,"endTime":1535.681,"body":"application in high temperatureFische-\u200aTropsch synthesis."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1535.681,"endTime":1540.611,"body":"So , temperatures between250 and 350 degrees Celsius."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1541.181,"endTime":1547.941,"body":"And, um, since iron is also watergas shift, active, you can also"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1547.941,"endTime":1550.909,"body":"feed carbon dioxide and, there."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1550.909,"endTime":1556.489,"body":"Then the iron catalyst can, um, canconvert it into CO and hydrogen."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1557.269,"endTime":1559.449,"body":"And this would also be possible."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1559.539,"endTime":1565.309,"body":"So it could also be an option to,um, feed CO2 directly from like"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1565.399,"endTime":1569.419,"body":"different carbon dioxide sourcesand feed it to the reactor."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1570.489,"endTime":1570.909,"body":"Kevin: Mm-hmm."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1572.554,"endTime":1577.714,"body":"When you have the synthesis gasproduction, you get a lot of side"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1577.714,"endTime":1582.874,"body":"products and these side products mightharm the catalyst and would deactivate"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1582.874,"endTime":1585.214,"body":"and the synthesis, what are the."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1586.099,"endTime":1589.429,"body":"Site products you want toavoid that you want to get out."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1590.029,"endTime":1594.139,"body":"I mean, ideally you want toonly have CO and hydrogen, but"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1594.289,"endTime":1595.519,"body":"I assume there are also some."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1597.409,"endTime":1600.799,"body":"Theresa: Yeah, there are, there arevarious, site products that we don't"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1600.799,"endTime":1602.509,"body":"want to have, for example, tars."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1603.229,"endTime":1610.499,"body":"We want to get rid of them, and we dothat by using some rape seed methyl and"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1610.739,"endTime":1614.069,"body":"ester, um, or like biodiesel, scrubbers."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1614.899,"endTime":1619.249,"body":"We use them at higher temperatures andthen we also have a low temperature"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1619.339,"endTime":1621.199,"body":"scrubber to get rid of them."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1621.979,"endTime":1626.299,"body":"Then the syn gas also includessome, um, soot particles"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1626.539,"endTime":1628.424,"body":"that we get rid in cyclones."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1629.344,"endTime":1636.334,"body":"And, um, the most important thing is toget rid of some sulfur components that"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1636.334,"endTime":1642.424,"body":"would definitely, um, harm the catalystand would deactivate it and poison it."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1642.741,"endTime":1648.691,"body":"That we get rid on within theactivated carbon beds that we have."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1648.781,"endTime":1651.961,"body":"And also ammonia is alsonot good for the catalyst."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1652.141,"endTime":1659.281,"body":"So for that we use some waterscrubbers and, um, yeah, I think"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1659.281,"endTime":1662.551,"body":"that is the most important thingthat we can have to get rid of."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1662.821,"endTime":1663.061,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1664.426,"endTime":1665.866,"body":"Kevin: And, uh, with this."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1666.541,"endTime":1674.521,"body":"Clean synthesis gas, you then go intothe Fische-\u200aTropsch reactor, and then I"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1674.521,"endTime":1681.601,"body":"assume, because the synthesis is not veryselective for one chain length, you have"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1681.601,"endTime":1684.201,"body":"to do some downstream processing as well."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1685.157,"endTime":1685.406,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1685.696,"endTime":1686.236,"body":"Theresa: exactly."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1686.236,"endTime":1692.744,"body":"So, um, maybe I can give you an, inan insight into our, um, plant set up."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1692.744,"endTime":1697.844,"body":"So we are using, uh, thisslowly bubble column technology."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1698.034,"endTime":1702.444,"body":"I mean, this is a weird, weirdword and I think not, not a"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1702.444,"endTime":1704.364,"body":"lot of you know what it is."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1704.364,"endTime":1708.664,"body":"So I am just going to giveyou an insight, briefly."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1708.664,"endTime":1714.844,"body":"So basically you can imagine it,um, as being and cylinder filled"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1714.844,"endTime":1719.839,"body":"with some wax in a liquid stateat these process conditions."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1720.439,"endTime":1725.969,"body":"Um, and the syngas is, entering thereactor at the bottom via a sintered"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1725.989,"endTime":1732.479,"body":"plate, which is just a plate withreally small holes in it, and, then the"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1732.479,"endTime":1735.749,"body":"catalyst is suspended within the liquid."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1736.169,"endTime":1742.799,"body":"Um, and the, the syngas then reactswith this catalyst and forms also"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1742.799,"endTime":1747.659,"body":"like different, um, hydrocarbonchains in different lengths."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1747.719,"endTime":1751.769,"body":"And, uh, then the product isbeing removed at the, at the top"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1751.769,"endTime":1754.049,"body":"of the reactor via some filters."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1754.049,"endTime":1758.819,"body":"To avoid that, the catalyst is alsolike being washed out of the system"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1759.299,"endTime":1761.189,"body":"and to retain it in the reactor."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1761.474,"endTime":1763.454,"body":"Kevin: So it's gettingout there in liquid form."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1764.234,"endTime":1765.824,"body":"Theresa: Yeah, liquid and gas form."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1765.824,"endTime":1769.834,"body":"I would be really curious how it looksbecause, um, in our plants we cannot"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1769.834,"endTime":1775.954,"body":"have a look inside since we already havelike some, like our reactor itself has,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1776.054,"endTime":1781.194,"body":"height of three meters and a diameterof 30 centimeters and it's made of"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1781.224,"endTime":1783.504,"body":"steel, so we cannot have a look inside."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1783.684,"endTime":1786.624,"body":"That would be really cool if itwould be glass or something like"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1786.624,"endTime":1788.034,"body":"that, so that you could see."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1788.124,"endTime":1788.484,"body":"Kevin: window."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1788.694,"endTime":1789.264,"body":"Theresa: But yeah."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1790.224,"endTime":1797.324,"body":"Um, but basically it enters in a liquidand gas state, and then we, um, have to"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1797.514,"endTime":1803.354,"body":"condensate the product and we do it bylowering the temperature according to the"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1803.354,"endTime":1806.084,"body":"desired, um, fractions we want to get."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1806.084,"endTime":1810.074,"body":"So for example, the waxes,these are the, the longer chain"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1810.074,"endTime":1811.814,"body":"hydrocarbons they condensate."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1812.204,"endTime":1816.254,"body":"At higher temperatures than thenaphta fraction, for example,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1816.254,"endTime":1821.264,"body":"which is the fraction between Cfour and C eight, um, for example."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1821.534,"endTime":1826.574,"body":"So, we then apply a free stagethermal condensation process."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1827.174,"endTime":1832.494,"body":"It is basically just, we have some,heat exchanges at different temperatures"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1832.494,"endTime":1837.113,"body":"and some vessels and there, then theproduct condensates, and the remaining"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1837.113,"endTime":1842.963,"body":"gas then flows to the next condenserat the lower temperature and so on."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1842.993,"endTime":1846.713,"body":"So it is a three stage condensation."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1847.133,"endTime":1851.243,"body":"And then, uh, we get theproduct of the three stages."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1851.243,"endTime":1854.603,"body":"So we have some wax in the firststage, then we have the diesel"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1854.603,"endTime":1858.923,"body":"fraction in the middle, and thennaphta fraction in the third condenser."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1859.253,"endTime":1864.773,"body":"And if we then want to use it asa, for example, substitute for"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1864.803,"endTime":1867.623,"body":"diesel, we have to refine it further"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1867.643,"endTime":1868.063,"body":"Kevin: Mm-hmm."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1868.988,"endTime":1873.398,"body":"So, you get three crudeproducts basically."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1873.638,"endTime":1876.968,"body":"Do you also get a gas fractionthat you can feed back into the"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1877.188,"endTime":1879.668,"body":"rector or is it completely used up?"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1880.898,"endTime":1881.348,"body":"Theresa: Yes."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1881.408,"endTime":1882.848,"body":"Um, that's, that's true."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1882.848,"endTime":1887.228,"body":"We also have remaininggas that is not converted."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1887.618,"endTime":1891.578,"body":"And also there is some methanethat is formed, which is, which,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1891.608,"endTime":1894.758,"body":"which doesn't, uh, condense atthese temperatures that we have."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1895.118,"endTime":1898.918,"body":"So we also cycled this remaining tail gas."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1898.968,"endTime":1903.198,"body":"We name it, um, back to thereactor to enhance the overall"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1903.198,"endTime":1904.728,"body":"conversion of the process."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1905.028,"endTime":1905.328,"body":"Kevin: Hmm."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1905.598,"endTime":1905.928,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1906.588,"endTime":1907.158,"body":"Interesting."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1907.368,"endTime":1911.748,"body":"So also the methane can go backin the rector and it will then"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1912.108,"endTime":1916.068,"body":"start or will attach to anotherchain that it becomes longer?"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1916.068,"endTime":1918.498,"body":"Or is the methane just cycling around?"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1919.473,"endTime":1923.793,"body":"Theresa: Yeah, unfortunately themethane is like, cycling, just around"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1923.793,"endTime":1926.333,"body":"and just, uh, increasing over time."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1926.363,"endTime":1930.493,"body":"It would be great, if we would havea steam reform in the tail gas loop"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1930.493,"endTime":1935.383,"body":"so that we could reform the methaneto, um, hydrogen and carbon monoxide."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1936.403,"endTime":1941.413,"body":"But in our process configuration,we don't have that since we, since"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1941.413,"endTime":1945.703,"body":"we are quite small and it is quiteexpensive, these kind of steam"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1945.703,"endTime":1947.383,"body":"reformers, but we are looking into it."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1947.443,"endTime":1947.713,"body":"But"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1947.768,"endTime":1949.668,"body":"Kevin: So for a larger plant, that might"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1949.723,"endTime":1949.843,"body":"Theresa: Mm-hmm."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1950.083,"endTime":1950.143,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1950.953,"endTime":1952.273,"body":"You definitely have to do that."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1952.363,"endTime":1954.163,"body":"Yeah, you definitely need that."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1954.853,"endTime":1956.713,"body":"Um, yes, exactly."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1956.713,"endTime":1960.978,"body":"And so if you want to use then thewaxes and the chemicals that, uh,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1961.008,"endTime":1965.328,"body":"have been produced, you definitelyneed some downstream processing."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1965.848,"endTime":1971.418,"body":"You need some hydrocracking for thewaxes in order to get the jet fuel"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1971.418,"endTime":1978.378,"body":"range with, which is in the chainlength range of C eight to C 16."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1978.678,"endTime":1985.518,"body":"Um, I think, and then also, we needsome isomerization processes to improve"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1985.518,"endTime":1988.398,"body":"the cold flow properties of the fuel."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1989.238,"endTime":1994.698,"body":"Um, yeah, but like, I think thereare also several other necessary"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1994.698,"endTime":1999.648,"body":"steps maybe, but I'm, but that's notmy research area, so I cannot give"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":1999.648,"endTime":2001.838,"body":"you that much insight into this."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2001.883,"endTime":2005.153,"body":"Kevin: but you get thejet fuel out of the wax"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2006.533,"endTime":2007.703,"body":"Theresa: And the diesel f Yeah."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2007.823,"endTime":2008.153,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2008.213,"endTime":2010.463,"body":"Um, it is al always a mixture."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2010.478,"endTime":2014.903,"body":"So I, so I think if you give thenthe wax and the diesel to the, to a"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2014.903,"endTime":2019.753,"body":"refinery partner for example, theythen hydro crack the wax, and then"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2019.903,"endTime":2025.883,"body":"they also mix some diesel fractioninto this mixture to produce the desire"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2026.183,"endTime":2026.383,"body":"Kevin: Mm-hmm."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2026.733,"endTime":2030.818,"body":"Because the hydrocracking yieldssimilar chain length than the diesel"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2031.703,"endTime":2031.793,"body":"Theresa: Mm-hmm."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2032.093,"endTime":2032.423,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2033.683,"endTime":2040.313,"body":"No, you can, basically decide, uh, via theprocess conditions, which chain lengths"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2040.313,"endTime":2041.753,"body":"you want to get out of the hydrocracker."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2042.788,"endTime":2048.788,"body":"Kevin: And then the third fraction,the light fraction that can be"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2048.788,"endTime":2052.153,"body":"used to synthesize chemicalsor what do you do with this?"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2053.063,"endTime":2053.423,"body":"Theresa: Yeah."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2053.453,"endTime":2057.983,"body":"Um, I would say you could usethat for some base chemicals."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2058.343,"endTime":2064.633,"body":"You, um, since they are like small,smaller chain, you can try to even,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2064.993,"endTime":2070.813,"body":"like crack it more so, so, so that, thatyou get ethane or something like that."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2071.503,"endTime":2075.913,"body":"Um, yeah, I would say like basechemicals you can make out of that."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2077.293,"endTime":2077.473,"body":"Kevin: Yeah."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2077.473,"endTime":2084.073,"body":"So you could also not just, uh,transform the fuel production, but also."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2085.003,"endTime":2089.623,"body":"The chemical production with this,because it's so low in the value"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2089.623,"endTime":2094.543,"body":"chain that it basically is thebeginning for a new kind of synthesis."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2094.843,"endTime":2095.443,"body":"Interesting."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2095.818,"endTime":2096.358,"body":"Theresa: Exactly."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2096.358,"endTime":2096.598,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2096.901,"endTime":2101.551,"body":"There are, there is a quite hugevariety of products that you could,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2101.611,"endTime":2104.401,"body":"um, synthesize with this process."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2105.621,"endTime":2110.581,"body":"Kevin: I guess it's also for thechemistry to have a. Steam cracker"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2110.581,"endTime":2115.381,"body":"that is competitive to the currentsteam crackers, and you would"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2115.501,"endTime":2118.231,"body":"also need very large quantities."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2119.701,"endTime":2120.001,"body":"maybe"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2120.001,"endTime":2124.201,"body":"also I think for the future,but yeah, it might get there."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2124.981,"endTime":2125.071,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2125.551,"endTime":2125.731,"body":"Theresa: yeah."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2125.731,"endTime":2130.701,"body":"I think, we have to adapt ourcurrent setups, also in the refinery,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2130.901,"endTime":2136.211,"body":"processes that, um can handlethese smaller scales, I would say."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2137.021,"endTime":2140.561,"body":"So we just have like the chemicalengineers and the chemists."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2140.846,"endTime":2144.779,"body":"They just have to work togetherand find new solutions, for"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2144.779,"endTime":2146.789,"body":"the smaller scale productions."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2147.239,"endTime":2152.819,"body":"Because if you just want to, um,substitute the fossil based feed"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2152.819,"endTime":2157.979,"body":"stocks and then put like reallysmaller, like really small quantities"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2157.979,"endTime":2162.689,"body":"into existing infrastructure, Ithink that will not be profitable."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2164.109,"endTime":2169.934,"body":"Kevin: But do you think it couldbe possible to have such a small"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2169.934,"endTime":2174.34,"body":"plant, for example, near Fuelingstation at the auto-bahn, and then"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2175.45,"endTime":2180.67,"body":"you basically produce all the fuelyou need for this fueling station"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2181.45,"endTime":2182.08,"body":"Theresa: yeah."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2182.41,"endTime":2182.68,"body":"yeah."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2182.86,"endTime":2183.34,"body":"yeah."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2183.34,"endTime":2188.3,"body":"Uh, so I mean this, this idea is notthat, abstract I would say because, uh,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2188.3,"endTime":2193.517,"body":"actually we have now a project, wherewe want to,  scale our technology up"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2193.637,"endTime":2200.007,"body":"and, um, this would happen I think inStyria, so in the, middle part of Austria."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2200.547,"endTime":2207.247,"body":"And there in the project, plan, wealso want to build, a refining part of"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2207.247,"endTime":2213.327,"body":"the syn crude we call our FT product,in, in the size of a container."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2213.597,"endTime":2219.387,"body":"So, uh, we actually want to do that,that we also can, we find the product"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2219.387,"endTime":2222.977,"body":"directly, besides the existing plant."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2223.142,"endTime":2223.562,"body":"Kevin: Mm-hmm."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2224.277,"endTime":2229.872,"body":"Inside a container that seems challengingbecause usually when I imagine a refinery,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2230.022,"endTime":2238.757,"body":"they have all these 20 columns for therefractive distillation and stuff like"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2238.847,"endTime":2239.027,"body":"Theresa: Yeah."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2239.027,"endTime":2242.867,"body":"I'm also really curious how, how,how they are going to defend that."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2242.867,"endTime":2244.637,"body":"But, uh, we will hopefully."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2245.192,"endTime":2248.352,"body":"See that, it is alsopossible, on a smaller scale."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2249.117,"endTime":2249.327,"body":"Kevin: Yeah."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2249.327,"endTime":2254.817,"body":"But maybe also at this scale, othertechnologies then distillation might work."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2254.817,"endTime":2255.447,"body":"Who knows?"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2255.882,"endTime":2256.932,"body":"Theresa: Mm, yeah."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2256.932,"endTime":2261.427,"body":"Yeah, I think it is possible,but that's not my research topic,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2261.427,"endTime":2264.037,"body":"so I cannot, uh, dig into that."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2264.832,"endTime":2267.892,"body":"Kevin: But then, um, for the plants."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2268.357,"endTime":2274.477,"body":"You are building now, um, you toldme before that, um, you started with"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2274.477,"endTime":2279.097,"body":"some parts of it and then you arenow fitting all the parts together."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2279.097,"endTime":2288.337,"body":"So your approach is now to actuallygo from the waste to the final product"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2289.357,"endTime":2289.747,"body":"Theresa: Yes."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2289.747,"endTime":2290.647,"body":"Kevin: and um, yeah."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2290.647,"endTime":2294.427,"body":"What is the main challenge in doing that?"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2294.427,"endTime":2294.727,"body":"I think."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2295.537,"endTime":2301.357,"body":"Each process step on its own is mucheasier than combining them all together."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2301.357,"endTime":2301.687,"body":"Right?"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2301.687,"endTime":2304.177,"body":"So, so what are thechallenges in combining them?"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2305.317,"endTime":2305.497,"body":"Theresa: yeah."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2305.497,"endTime":2311.197,"body":"The challenge, um, is, um, forexample, the feedstock variability."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2311.467,"endTime":2318.167,"body":"So like if you get one container of woodchips, um, this container can deviate"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2318.167,"endTime":2319.727,"body":"from another container that you get."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2320.117,"endTime":2325.627,"body":"So, um, it is quite difficult to predictthe single's composition and, for the"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2325.627,"endTime":2327.397,"body":"Fische-\u200aTropsch synthesis, for example."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2328.207,"endTime":2332.817,"body":"The, H to CO ratio is,um, really important."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2332.817,"endTime":2334.227,"body":"So it should be around two."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2334.887,"endTime":2340.077,"body":"And so the the gasification,um, section should provide the"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2340.077,"endTime":2341.997,"body":"singers with that composition."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2342.357,"endTime":2347.717,"body":"But, if the feedstock varies, thenthe, then there are some deviations"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2347.717,"endTime":2350.387,"body":"from this optimal, um, composition."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2351.107,"endTime":2357.437,"body":"And so I think the most important ordifficult part is to, keep the gasifier"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2357.437,"endTime":2360.787,"body":"running with our desired, syngas range."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2361.417,"endTime":2368.287,"body":"Um, and another thing is if you then usemore challenging feedstocks, like sewage"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2368.287,"endTime":2374.187,"body":"sludge or also like, we have tried to usea mixture, of wood chips and plastics."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2375.162,"endTime":2379.142,"body":"Then you get like, quitechallenging contaminations."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2379.682,"endTime":2385.112,"body":"Um, within the gas you get more,sulfur components and also some,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2385.572,"endTime":2389.152,"body":"ammonia components that are notdesirable within the syngas."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2389.412,"endTime":2393.402,"body":"So you have to, um, adaptthe syngas cleaning part."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2394.092,"endTime":2400.162,"body":"And, this is a part like the singlescleaning is a research area that not"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2400.162,"endTime":2405.582,"body":"a lot of, researchers have focused onsince, uh, we only have always looked"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2405.582,"endTime":2410.352,"body":"at the syngas production and then theuse of the syngas within the reactor."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2410.352,"endTime":2413.922,"body":"But the, um, the bridge betweenit, the singers cleaning."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2414.537,"endTime":2420.357,"body":"This is a topic that, that no onewas like, thought about it because,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2420.407,"endTime":2425.447,"body":"we have a professor, for example,that, that, uh, revolutionized the"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2425.937,"endTime":2430.527,"body":"gasification parts because we have a,like advanced gasification technology."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2431.457,"endTime":2435.867,"body":"And the Fische-\u200aTropsch part is alsolike state of the art, but the cleaning"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2435.867,"endTime":2438.257,"body":"of the gas that is quite challenging."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2438.257,"endTime":2444.227,"body":"So we are now looking into how tomodify the gas cleaning, depending"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2444.227,"endTime":2445.937,"body":"on the feed that we are using."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2445.982,"endTime":2446.402,"body":"Kevin: Mm-hmm."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2447.377,"endTime":2456.557,"body":"Is it a, a fixed process or can you havesome modular concepts where you, I don't"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2456.557,"endTime":2459.977,"body":"know, have some, you know, the feedstock."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2460.757,"endTime":2465.317,"body":"Is wood chips and then you know,okay, usually we have only these"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2465.347,"endTime":2471.707,"body":"contaminations and you don't needprocess step X, and when you put also"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2471.707,"endTime":2475.397,"body":"plastic into the mix, then you definitelyneed also this other process step."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2475.547,"endTime":2478.097,"body":"Or is it one big thing?"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2478.907,"endTime":2484.027,"body":"Theresa: Yeah, so in our current setup,and I also think that, in industrially"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2484.097,"endTime":2490.337,"body":"applied processes, um, there will beno, like modular gas cleaning steps."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2490.577,"endTime":2495.977,"body":"I think there will be like, like theglass, the gas cleaning should be possible"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2495.977,"endTime":2503.337,"body":"to clean the gas, um, with the worst, Iwould say feed, gas, um, feed, gas source."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2504.107,"endTime":2508.547,"body":"And I think that is also really importantpoint that we have to keep in mind,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2508.847,"endTime":2511.767,"body":"for the adoption of this technology."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2512.652,"endTime":2518.242,"body":"And the bigger plants should focuson one, feedstock and like optimize"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2518.242,"endTime":2522.122,"body":"this gas cleaning and then alsodownstream the Fische-\u200aTropsch process."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2522.602,"endTime":2527.672,"body":"And another one should focus, forexample, on using, um, plastic fractions,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2528.062,"endTime":2532.592,"body":"because then I think that's easieralso for the gasification part because"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2532.892,"endTime":2538.432,"body":"it is way easier to gasify woodybiomass than some plastic fractions."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2538.432,"endTime":2546.252,"body":"Because yeah, they have like way moretasks and it is way  more so, or complex."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2546.252,"endTime":2554.262,"body":"So I think, um, the plant should likeonly use one specific feedstock and"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2554.262,"endTime":2558.322,"body":"then, adopt and required cleaning steps."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2559.118,"endTime":2565.658,"body":"Kevin: So like traditional oil refineries,which process mainly one kind of"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2565.838,"endTime":2572.335,"body":"oil, for example, from the North Sea,and have specialized exactly to that"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2572.365,"endTime":2574.255,"body":"impurities that come from this source."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2574.732,"endTime":2579.117,"body":"Theresa: Yeah, I think that's, um,that's the easier approach because our"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2579.147,"endTime":2585.307,"body":"gasification plant can also like, dealwith the more challenging feedstocks, but"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2585.307,"endTime":2590.557,"body":"we see if you use them, that we have likeway more issues during the operation."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2591.217,"endTime":2596.027,"body":"I mean, it is possible and you canjust adopt the, the gasification part"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2596.057,"endTime":2603.277,"body":"by like, um, changing some screws orlike conveyor belts and make them more"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2603.277,"endTime":2605.317,"body":"resilient to these feed feedstocks."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2606.217,"endTime":2608.917,"body":"Um, but I think it is easier if you."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2609.272,"endTime":2611.702,"body":"Operate a plant alwayswith the same feedstock."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2611.912,"endTime":2616.906,"body":"But in our case, we want to demonstratethe use of different feedstocks"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2616.986,"endTime":2619.146,"body":"to some, uh, industrial partners."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2619.146,"endTime":2624.596,"body":"And therefore, our plant is capableof operating nearly everything."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2625.706,"endTime":2630.896,"body":"But I think, um, when you want tobuild, a bigger plant than the size"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2630.896,"endTime":2636.236,"body":"of some megawatts, then you definitelyshould focus on one feedstock."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2636.621,"endTime":2643.941,"body":"Kevin: So that is how you bridge thegap from research to industry, because"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2644.241,"endTime":2650.061,"body":"in this way you show which kind ofpurification works and which not."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2650.091,"endTime":2654.621,"body":"And then the industry partners canadopt that technology for their"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2654.621,"endTime":2656.511,"body":"plants and go to a bigger scale."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2656.581,"endTime":2657.451,"body":"Theresa: Yeah, exactly."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2657.721,"endTime":2663.811,"body":"Because our gasifier, for example,has a, um, a input capacity of, uh,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2663.811,"endTime":2670.446,"body":"one megawatt and, um, I think likeindustrial plants should be in the"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2670.446,"endTime":2674.881,"body":"range of at least 10 to 50 megawatts."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2674.971,"endTime":2680.991,"body":"So really bigger, like a huge stepthen towards the next generation."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2681.381,"endTime":2686.861,"body":"And our Fischer-Tropsch part onlyuses 250 kilowatts of this, um,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2687.221,"endTime":2689.771,"body":"syngas that is being produced"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2690.161,"endTime":2696.611,"body":"since we, um, have used the reactor thatwas al already existing and this reactor"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2696.611,"endTime":2699.911,"body":"was commissioned at another facility."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2700.601,"endTime":2702.131,"body":"So we are limited with that."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2702.131,"endTime":2706.861,"body":"And now we, um, looking just inthe coupling of the two plants."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2707.021,"endTime":2710.831,"body":"Kevin: The next step would be to scaleup this whole plant, since you have shown"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2710.831,"endTime":2717.041,"body":"that each separate parts of the plant workon their own, now you have connected them."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2717.402,"endTime":2719.622,"body":"So the next step would be scale up."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2720.273,"endTime":2725.908,"body":"But this is then done by the industrypartners who pick up your technology"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2726.128,"endTime":2728.122,"body":"and use it on a larger scale."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2728.122,"endTime":2728.442,"body":"Right?"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2728.742,"endTime":2734.036,"body":"Theresa: So basically our processdesign already works in, in our scale."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2734.036,"endTime":2739.316,"body":"And I think also this, um, processsteps involved and also the"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2739.316,"endTime":2742.166,"body":"different reactors and plant units."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2742.446,"endTime":2746.916,"body":"If you want to build a bigger one, thenI think you can just build up on that."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2747.276,"endTime":2752.796,"body":"And we, we have already designed somebigger plants with our technology,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2752.796,"endTime":2754.986,"body":"so this is definitely possible."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2754.986,"endTime":2760.198,"body":"But the industry partners theyare resistant because it is"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2760.618,"endTime":2765.771,"body":"really new and not a lot of,companies have these technologies."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2766.461,"endTime":2769.311,"body":"They are hesitant to enter this market."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2769.731,"endTime":2774.861,"body":"But, um, basically it would work withour technology and we, we have shown it"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2774.861,"endTime":2781.141,"body":"in several campaigns that we can convertsustainable feedstocks into as a SAF."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2781.201,"endTime":2783.111,"body":"So sustainable aviation fuels."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2784.381,"endTime":2784.711,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2785.011,"endTime":2787.321,"body":"But uh, you need the courage."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2788.508,"endTime":2792.018,"body":"Kevin: Yeah, I think, yeah, withthe really big companies, it's"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2792.018,"endTime":2798.858,"body":"always a problem to adopt newtechnologies because it might fail."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2798.908,"endTime":2807.353,"body":"It's not an established technology, sothey have to think about doing their"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2807.353,"endTime":2813.983,"body":"own research or not, and this is reallygreat that there are companies like Best"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2814.033,"endTime":2820.723,"body":"where you can support this transitionfrom research into the industry."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2821.025,"endTime":2821.235,"body":"Theresa: Yeah."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2821.235,"endTime":2826.225,"body":"So that's, that is our aim to likehelp our industry partners to adopt"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2826.225,"endTime":2831.505,"body":"this, uh, technology for theirmarkets and for their projects."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2831.895,"endTime":2837.685,"body":"So we don't, like, we don't have patentsor anything like that, so our interest"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2837.685,"endTime":2844.095,"body":"is on, bringing this process furtherand producing sustainable chemicals."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2844.733,"endTime":2850.313,"body":"Kevin: And there the Fischer-Tropschprocess really has potential, and also"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2850.343,"endTime":2858.083,"body":"for jet fuels alone from the quota thatwill be coming from the EU regulation."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2858.233,"endTime":2864.473,"body":"This will drive demand, and then we needthese production capacities to keep up."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2864.774,"endTime":2865.644,"body":"Theresa: Yes, exactly."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2865.914,"endTime":2870.808,"body":"I mean, there are different pathsto substitute the, uh jet fuels,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2870.808,"endTime":2875.148,"body":"but the Fischer-Tropsch synthesispart is already  ASTM approved."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2875.358,"endTime":2883.728,"body":"So this this fuel regulation and I thinklike the European Union, um, wants to"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2883.728,"endTime":2889.008,"body":"decarbonize in the near future alreadylike the aviation sector quite rapidly."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2889.518,"endTime":2896.758,"body":"And right now, um, the current mix thatis pot possible to use our Fischer-Tropsch"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2896.778,"endTime":2899.958,"body":"fuel in the aviation sector is 50%."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2899.958,"endTime":2906.053,"body":"So you can like mix the fossil basedfuel with, 50% of the renewable fuel"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2906.293,"endTime":2912.323,"body":"and, there are already some aircraftand airplanes that are flying with"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2912.323,"endTime":2914.203,"body":"this sustainable aviation fuel."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2914.203,"endTime":2920.033,"body":"So it is working and is, it is also quiteclean the product that we give because,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2920.038,"endTime":2926.933,"body":"um, it lacks off aromatics and othercomponents that are not that favorable."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2927.423,"endTime":2930.843,"body":"But yeah, the demand is really huge."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2931.053,"endTime":2937.053,"body":"And so I also think that in thenear future there will be, and they"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2937.083,"endTime":2942.323,"body":"have to be, more Fischer-Tropschplants using renewable biomass"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2942.323,"endTime":2945.203,"body":"or, or other feedstock sources."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2946.313,"endTime":2950.453,"body":"Um, but nevertheless, I think it,it'll be a mixture because there"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2950.453,"endTime":2954.463,"body":"are also different routes withwhich can produce sustainable fuel."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2954.613,"endTime":2959.613,"body":"I think we have to adopt all thesetechnologies in order to substitute"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2959.613,"endTime":2965.183,"body":"now the fossil fuel and to reach theambitious goal of the European Union."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2965.517,"endTime":2968.787,"body":"Kevin: Other feedstock, uh,could also be CO2, right?"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2969.029,"endTime":2975.523,"body":"and then use CO2 and hydrogen tomake synthesis gas, and then use"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2975.528,"endTime":2979.667,"body":"this in the Fisher-Tropsch synthesis."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2979.912,"endTime":2980.182,"body":"Theresa: Yeah."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2980.692,"endTime":2982.732,"body":"Um, this is a quite hot topic."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2982.832,"endTime":2988.282,"body":"We have seen a lot of differentconference contributions, um, to that."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2988.672,"endTime":2992.842,"body":"Uh, it's the conference where wemet, and also a colleague of mine who"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2992.872,"endTime":2999.202,"body":"recently joined the company is lookinginto exactly this, path, um, to use CO2"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":2999.202,"endTime":3002.555,"body":"directly, by using iron based catalyst."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3002.975,"endTime":3009.645,"body":"That is a hot topic, but in my opinion,if you use CO2 instead of co then you"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3009.645,"endTime":3011.475,"body":"have an additional conversion step."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3011.475,"endTime":3016.665,"body":"So you have to convert first CO2into CO and that makes the, the whole"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3016.665,"endTime":3019.562,"body":"process  more inefficient, I would say."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3020.282,"endTime":3026.872,"body":"So I, I see that there is going to be alot of research, but on the short term, I"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3026.872,"endTime":3032.482,"body":"think the cobalt base catalyst are still,more efficient than the iron based ones."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3033.249,"endTime":3036.759,"body":"Kevin: Yeah, we probably need,uh, all the solutions we have."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3036.759,"endTime":3038.733,"body":"It's not just the CO2."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3039.253,"endTime":3042.613,"body":"we also need to convertthe waste and use that."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3043.753,"endTime":3047.803,"body":"And the fisher tur synthesiscombined with your gasification"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3047.803,"endTime":3049.903,"body":"technology would be a great option."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3050.199,"endTime":3051.129,"body":"Theresa: Yes, exactly."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3051.459,"endTime":3059.289,"body":"So, um, I think that, the Fischer-Tropschsynthesis is a really good, solution"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3059.289,"endTime":3063.189,"body":"to that, or also contribution tothis issue that we are facing."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3063.849,"endTime":3069.253,"body":"And the, the thing is now only thatwe have to like, build the plants"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3069.413,"endTime":3073.573,"body":"and that the industry really adoptsour research and technologies."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3073.573,"endTime":3079.213,"body":"And, um, we have seen at a conference thatvarious research groups are working on"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3079.213,"endTime":3085.193,"body":"this topic and it is, still nevertheless,um, it is already like 100 years old."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3085.553,"endTime":3091.093,"body":"There is huge interest in, in furtheroptimizing the synthesis and understanding"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3091.093,"endTime":3096.963,"body":"the word underlying principles to,um, use alternative feedstocks."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3097.463,"endTime":3104.393,"body":"Kevin: Also in combination withElectrolyzers, this technology can be"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3104.393,"endTime":3112.323,"body":"used to turn electricity into liquidfuels, which is a very powerful option."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3112.323,"endTime":3112.803,"body":"I think."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3113.673,"endTime":3120.903,"body":"For example, if we use surplus electricitythat we cannot use, otherwise we could"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3121.413,"endTime":3128.253,"body":"store it into jet fuel and then use thatfor aviation where we have currently"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3128.253,"endTime":3129.963,"body":"no other option than liquid fuels."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3130.785,"endTime":3135.225,"body":"Theresa: Yeah, I really see,um, the adoption of the power"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3135.225,"endTime":3137.225,"body":"to liquid processes coming up."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3137.615,"endTime":3143.775,"body":"So, um, within this technologyyou use like electric energy."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3144.93,"endTime":3149.09,"body":"And, a carbon sourcelike, um, ideally CO2."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3149.36,"endTime":3154.5,"body":"And then you can like synthesis, theFisher-Tropsch products like only"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3154.53,"endTime":3162.645,"body":"by using CO2 and, um, and energy tosynthesize then the, the necessary syngas."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3163.315,"endTime":3166.845,"body":"And, we have now already aproject in that direction."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3166.845,"endTime":3174.115,"body":"So there's going to be, um, anotherplant, um electrolyzer that will"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3174.115,"endTime":3180.335,"body":"supply, uh, different syngas then,because we see here also like a huge"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3180.335,"endTime":3184.105,"body":"potential and they're also like a lotof industries that they're now going"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3184.105,"endTime":3186.115,"body":"into the direction of electrolyzers."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3186.543,"endTime":3193.091,"body":"Kevin: You mean the co electrolyzerwhere you use CO2 directly?"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3193.146,"endTime":3194.136,"body":"Theresa: Yes, exactly."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3194.538,"endTime":3198.678,"body":"Kevin: Yeah, this is a reallyfascinating technology where you"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3198.678,"endTime":3203.978,"body":"can basically use water and CO2directly to get hydrogen and CO."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3204.097,"endTime":3209.707,"body":"Which is syn gas in one step insteadof separate step, where we have"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3209.707,"endTime":3215.377,"body":"first, the water electrolysis andthen the water gas shift reaction."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3216.037,"endTime":3218.797,"body":"And then you have your syngas gas."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3219.798,"endTime":3221.688,"body":"And with this, it's much more efficient."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3221.901,"endTime":3222.321,"body":"Theresa: Mm-hmm."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3222.726,"endTime":3222.756,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3222.756,"endTime":3223.146,"body":"Exactly."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3223.156,"endTime":3226.426,"body":"That is the exact technology thatwe are going to build at our,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3226.906,"endTime":3228.796,"body":"demonstration plan here in Vienna."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3229.306,"endTime":3233.896,"body":"And, um, if that project works out,then this would be really huge because"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3233.896,"endTime":3239.536,"body":"I think no one has ever built, um, aco electrolytes, uh, plant that size."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3239.566,"endTime":3243.076,"body":"But, therefore I really am lookingforward to this project and I really"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3243.076,"endTime":3247.816,"body":"hope that it's going to be successbecause with that, I think we would have"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3247.816,"endTime":3252.496,"body":"like already demonstrated two differentpathways to produce sustainable fuels."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3252.679,"endTime":3254.884,"body":"Kevin: The more, the better, I guess."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3255.244,"endTime":3259.984,"body":"This is, uh, great then forbecoming more independent from."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3260.194,"endTime":3268.774,"body":"Its energy imports and we can useour own electricity and the bio"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3268.774,"endTime":3271.204,"body":"waste we have to produce these fuels."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3271.355,"endTime":3275.399,"body":"Theresa: I mean, one question that I,that I always ask myself with, if we"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3275.399,"endTime":3281.609,"body":"have these power to liquid concepts is,um, do we really, or are we really able"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3281.609,"endTime":3286.259,"body":"to produce that much of electricitythat we have it like in surplus?"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3286.259,"endTime":3290.329,"body":"And then also is this, uh, surplusenergy really going to be that cheap"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3290.329,"endTime":3292.579,"body":"that we can operate these plants?"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3292.579,"endTime":3297.919,"body":"But in principle, this will bereally a nice, um, pathway also to"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3297.919,"endTime":3300.119,"body":"produce these Fischer-Tropsch fuels."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3300.998,"endTime":3307.478,"body":"Kevin: A lot of this will also dependon the regulations and what incentives"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3307.478,"endTime":3314.327,"body":"there will be to build such plants andactually use the, uh, renewable energy."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3314.558,"endTime":3314.858,"body":"Theresa: Yeah."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3314.858,"endTime":3320.418,"body":"And also like if the, government thengives some, or set some, um, incentives"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3320.758,"endTime":3325.668,"body":"for like producers and manufacturers touse these, these technologies so that"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3325.818,"endTime":3331.598,"body":"they get, like for example, if you getadditional money, if you, um, have like"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3331.598,"endTime":3337.718,"body":"some carbon neutral technologies, then Ithink, then the industries would even be"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3337.718,"endTime":3340.408,"body":"faster at adopting these technologies."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3340.408,"endTime":3342.538,"body":"But I don't know how it is in Germany."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3342.538,"endTime":3346.708,"body":"But in also, for example, we were like,I think two years ago at the point"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3346.708,"endTime":3349.288,"body":"or only, or also like one year ago."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3349.588,"endTime":3353.668,"body":"I can't remember when, whenthere should have been a new."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3354.458,"endTime":3358.788,"body":"Regulation, that would have likereally pushed it, uh, forward because"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3359.018,"endTime":3364.538,"body":"two years ago we, we still had thegreen party, uh, in our government,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3364.598,"endTime":3366.728,"body":"but unfortunately this never came."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3366.728,"endTime":3372.358,"body":"And then also a lot of these quite,innovative projects were canceled because"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3372.838,"endTime":3377.678,"body":"the, the industry then said, yeah,okay, if there is no incentive from the,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3377.888,"endTime":3382.508,"body":"from the government and no insurance,that they get a certain price for the"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3382.508,"endTime":3388.568,"body":"product, then they just like risk ofbuilding the, these plans is too high."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3389.178,"endTime":3393.158,"body":"I think the government plays ahuge role for the development"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3393.158,"endTime":3395.618,"body":"of these quite new technologies."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3396.217,"endTime":3397.297,"body":"Kevin: Yeah, definitely."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3397.777,"endTime":3404.317,"body":"As long as the fossil alternativesremain that cheap, the motivation"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3404.497,"endTime":3410.997,"body":"is just not big enough to commit tothis, uh, renewable energies because."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3412.427,"endTime":3417.797,"body":"Why should I invest in the greentechnology if others can make much"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3417.797,"endTime":3425.812,"body":"more money with the fossil fuelsand also for the electricity grid?"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3427.192,"endTime":3432.322,"body":"The more wind and solar we willintegrate into the grid, the"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3432.322,"endTime":3434.902,"body":"more surplus energy we will have."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3434.902,"endTime":3439.252,"body":"And this surplus energycould be also used by."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3440.527,"endTime":3446.527,"body":"Co electrolyzers and then make liquidfuels for jet fuel, for example,"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3446.527,"endTime":3448.142,"body":"that we have to produce anyway."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3448.296,"endTime":3449.316,"body":"Theresa: Yeah, exactly."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3449.326,"endTime":3454.561,"body":"This would be ideal if we could justthen, um, switch on our FT plants"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3455.121,"endTime":3461.981,"body":"and just use, the, the electricitywithin the co electrolyzers to"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3461.981,"endTime":3464.411,"body":"produce, um, renewable fuel."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3464.681,"endTime":3465.791,"body":"That would be ideal."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3466.031,"endTime":3468.791,"body":"I totally agree with you on that topic."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3469.335,"endTime":3469.785,"body":"Kevin: Great."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3470.39,"endTime":3476.75,"body":"Thank you very much Theresa for takingthe time to share your research."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3477.05,"endTime":3482.72,"body":"Talk with me about the Fischer-Tropschprocess, which is truly fascinating."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3483.023,"endTime":3483.983,"body":"thank you very much."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3484.098,"endTime":3484.668,"body":"Theresa: Yeah."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3484.668,"endTime":3486.828,"body":"Thank you very, verymuch for having me here."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3487.008,"endTime":3491.928,"body":"Um, it was a pleasure to explain myresearch a little bit and to talk"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3491.928,"endTime":3494.578,"body":"with you in a really nice environment."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3495.312,"endTime":3501.357,"body":"Kevin: I also thank you very much forlistening and spending the time with us."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3501.822,"endTime":3505.842,"body":"If you like this episode,please hit the follow button"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3505.842,"endTime":3508.995,"body":"and give this episode a review."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3509.045,"endTime":3511.235,"body":"This really helps toshow more than you think."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3512.443,"endTime":3516.853,"body":"If you want to read more aboutthe research at BEST, the links"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3516.853,"endTime":3518.773,"body":"will be in the show notes."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3519.553,"endTime":3525.558,"body":"And if you have an interesting topic todiscuss in the podcast, then send me an"},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3525.558,"endTime":3531.948,"body":"email to contact@innovateandreact.comor find me on LinkedIn."},{"speaker":null,"startTime":3532.284,"endTime":3535.863,"body":"Until next time, keepinnovating and stay curious."}]}